Appalachian Patria

Appalachian Intellectual. To me that means plain thinking. I am A Non Commissioned Officer in the Army Reserves. Let me say...My views expressed here are mine and not those of The U.S. Army, Army Reserve or my fellow brethren in The National Guard. This is entirely Sua Sponte. This is My Thinking. I'm single and in my mid 30's. Politicaly, I'm a Libertarian. (Again, Sua Sponte.I do not represent the Libertarian Party.)I love my native Appalachia, Rock n Roll and...I love God.

Name:
Location: Brevard, North Caroilina

I started blogging for two reasons. I was concerned about the changes to the area I live in, Southern Appalachia and I was about to go to the war. I was in Iraq in 06 and 07 and now Kuwait in 11 and 12. Blogging was a means of documenting my experiences and hoping it would help gain clarity. I don't feel that way about it any more. It's said people write blogs because they are frustrated, that's why people read them too. That makes us sound apocalyptic. Are we? Let it be said, what I say here is of my own thinking. This is entirely Sua Sponte and not an official representation of the U.S. Military or the U.S. Government as a whole.

Thursday, January 15, 2009

They Wanna Do What?

I'm a Hunter. There's no secret about that. I need not explain it, nor justify it to anyone. No apologies. It's not for everyone, simple and true. Yet, I choose to share little parts of it, in order that someone may benefit from what I say.

Wednesday Night the North Carolina Wildlife Commission held a meeting with us Hunters and Fishermen about proposed regulations. Sort of a Town Hall Meeting so to speak. If we Hunters don't give our input, then we become subject to the whims of the Commission, and the typical politician types of Raleigh. As well, the Biologist depend on the information we send them for allot of their research.

This meeting, representing the 9th Wildlife District, was held at Southwestern Community College over between Cullowee and Sylva. It was attended by Wildlife Officials, Biologist, Enforcement Officers (Game Wardens)and Hunters and Fishermen of every breed. To give cerdit, Ol' faithful Ranger Buddy Twister, talked me into going.

So, kinda copieing after NeoLibertarian's post, I submit some choice proposals and my thoughts. These are my thoughts, I do not represent anyone other than my damn Self. Thanks to the NC Camo Coalition, a great organization that can be emulated by allot of local Grass Roots Organizations, I bring this to you.

Fishing first.

F08, This concerned the South Toe River up in Yancey County, a tributary to the French Broad well above Asheville. Normally, I'd have no concern in this. I don't want to have folks in Yancey calling the shots for me in Transylvania if they never come here. It's not my back yard, I ain't been there since I don't know when. But, I am against it. Reason is designating it "catch and Release is a Trout Unlimited thing, and I don't care for them. Basically they lobby for stocking of Brown and Rainbow Trout, that aren't native to Appalachia. A Biologist said it to me, they stock those two species of Trout to make people like Trout Unlimited happy. Browns and Rainbows were brought in to restock the rivers after they were depleted of the native "Speckle" Trout due to run off from the over logging of the early 1900s. The Browns and Rainbows attack the Speckle. There would be more speckle, if not for them. To give credit, Twister talked me into going against it, which didn't take much convincing.

F31, is to prohibit the possession of Zebra Muscles. Zebra Muscles can cause some serious damage to streams and to Wastewater plants. I hold a NC Wastewater License and that concerns me some, I know the damage that can occur. Zebra Muscles are exotics, and the only exotic I'm for the importation of is exotic women. I believe the importation of exotic women could produce a healthy breeding stock. Everything else needs to go back to where it came from.

Hunting,

H3, removing the daily bag limit (2) on deer. I say no. Two is enough. Every Hunter that spoke on this issue was against it. Someone could drop their season limit (depends on where they are at) and be done in a day. I don't think anyone is that hungry. And, if allot of the Bucks are killed before they get the Does bred, what then?

H4, allowing Bow Hunting on Game Lands during the Muzzle Loading Season. I say, why not? Why does it matter if a Deer is taken with a Bow and Arrow or Black Powder? I used to Bow Hunt some, but, I fell out of it. And truth is, I'd rather shoot a Muzzle Loader of I can, but, it would provide opportunity to someone that does not have Black Powder capabilities.

H5, take the one week Muzzle Loading Season and making it two by taking a week of Bow Season. I say yes. This would give someone with limited time off to hunt Muzzle Loading Season, and if they can abide by H4 then it's a win win. Well, some Archers didn't like this. They said something about Safety. It's not any less safe in my eyes. To me, they don't like to share, they don't like the added pressure on Deer by having a few more Hunters in the woods. I fear that they can become like Trout Unlimited. Some other Hunters didn't care for H5, siting that with the newer in line Muzzle Loaders, they are about as good as a Center fire Rifle and early success can hurt the deer population. The latter have a point. But, not too many people can take time off in the early part, and the weather is till warm enough where Deer may lay down.

H6, this is east and north of me, where Deer have become more abundant, Yancey, McDowell and Rutherford counties and east. A uniform season is proposed, basically "Gun Season" from Oct 15th to Jan 1st. I have my concerns on this. While there may be a nice population of deer, it's not like Alabama. Down East, such a Season is feasible. No one spoke in favor of it. My concern, as well as theirs is it could seriously damage the population. One said Georgia did the same thing and he doesn't see the Deer he did down there. Some speculate that Insurance Companies are behind this, and as one man pointed, most Deer are hit at night, as well as near roadways when they can't be hunted as much.

H10, allow a permit only Hunt on the Daniel Boone Bear sanctuary. Apparently, it's covered up in Bear, as most Sanctuaries are. I say yes, it would pressure some Bear out of there, and balance the population. As well, as one Bear Hunter from Swain said, the Commission can study the effect. He was concerned, pointing how well the Sanctuary Program of the last 3o something odd years has tremendously helped the bear Population. Permits are not open hunting, so, a balance can be set. An abundance of Boars can hurt, males kill cubs.

There were two other bear Season Proposals and they concerned Down East, where I never venture, but would like to here some day to Hunt. So, I had no input into that. I also kept qiuet on the Turkey Season Proposals, which one was doing away with the Youth Only Day. No one liked that.

H17, Wild Boar, opening hog hunting in early September and taking it to the end of February. The Forest Service is requesting it because they are tearing the woods up.
I'm for it. Wild Boar are not native, their exotics, and you'll know how I feel about exotics. The truth is, they will tare up the woods. And, believing in a Southern Appalachian purity when it comes to the wild, they disturb that. As we become more crowded with development and wild swine having a high reproductive rate it could get to a bigger problem for our compromised Forests. They compete with Bear for habitat. If they end up on a Golf Course, well, they do. Invite us in to run them out, and fix your Golf Course. If they get into Agricultural Lands, we've got a problem. They can hurt stream quality too from whallering. Some of those from Graham County are against it. Hogs are a way of life over there. That is where the Russian Wild Boar was brought in. It's business over there around Robbinsville. They don't thin it hurts that much.
I see the cutting down of hogs promoting the surgance of Bear. God put Bear here, not hogs, we did that.

H18, open Bear Sanctuaries to Wild Boar Hunting, this would not allow Dogs. Yes. Let's do it. Do we want to cut down on them? This will allow Deer Hunters to cut down on them at chance. But, then east of Jackson County we can do this already.

The Dog issue makes some happy. I know people that want Bear Season shut down for a week before Gun Deer Season. They think that it makes the Deer nervous to have Dogs in the woods. I've learned that if Dogs are not running Deer, the Deer step aside and go about their business. Plus, there are Sanctuaries where Dogs run in and get pulled out. Compare what goes on between the two and you have your answer. There are those that Dog Deer under the guise of Bear Hunting, but they don't Bear Hunt, and do it after Deer Season mainly. I don't care for Dogging Deer, but in a healthy population, it's a method, like the SC Low Country an Down East NC. There are people that know how to Dog Deer and they could go into an area and you'd never know they had been there. Deer Doggers around here do hurt Deer Population. But the Dogs in the woods issue spooking Deer is not to buoyant in my eyes. If so, the Indians would have starved, right Pipsqeak? That is one reason I fear that the Bow and Trophy Deer Hunter crowd may become like Trout Unlimited. They want things to be like they are on the Outdoors Chanell. In their minds Hunting with Dogs is so passe'. Never mind many people that Hunt with Dogs Still and Stand Hunt Deer too. And, are selective about what they take. However, I can agree to no Dogs on Wild Boar on Bear sanctuaries, it can cut down on confusion and then, not let those that do cheat. In addition too, it can show some interesting results if properly studied.

Speaking of passe'...Not if You Were The Last Junkie On Earth.


How about those dance moves!! Special thanks to the Dandy Warhols for that enlightening video!

I used to have a thing for Zia until I seen that she got ink done. Then, I lost it. I look forward to the day when tattoos on women are so passe'.

H19, requiring the hard copy tagging of Big Game. Yes, this could discourage cheating, remind people to call or check it in and then allow for the Commission to collect more accurate data.

H20, Squirrel Season goes until the last of January, they want it extended to the end of February. I agreed to that. But then The NC Camo Coalition is against it because they are suckling young then. I didn't think that was for another month...Oops, my bad. They may have a point.

H26, allow Bow Hunting on Private Lands on Sundays. I agree to that. 7th Day Adventist have rights too. I don't think God minds that at all. For that matter, I don't think he minds allot of the things we are told is taboo.

H27, same as above but on Game Lands. Yes.

H29, get rid of the restrictions of Gun Caliber on Game Lands during the Hunting Season while Big Game is closed. I say YES. Hogs are legal as long as something is in season east of Jackson and Swain Counties, starting in Haywood and Transylvania. But, we can only use .22, .22 Magnum and Shotguns with #4 Shot or less. If they want us to kill these hogs, let us take something that will do the job. If you catch them between the eyes with a .22 you can kill them, but you've got to get aligned with the thing in a spot where it can gore you. If we can take something to down them, then more people would Hunt them with less fear of carrying a dead Dog from the woods. Hogs are deadly on dogs, and most Bear Dogs will run one, whether their owner likes it or not. But, fighting Bear and Hogs are two different skills. I'd be happy to hog Hunt with my .30 Carbine.

I didn't stick around for the whole meeting. I had to be at work at 0400, so after the hog discussion I left out of there.

Conservation is a beautiful thing. The Individual does not always see eye to eye with the Government, and it's good for them to come and ask you of your input. Conservation comes from the efforts of the individual as it does anything.

Again, this is just the way I see it.
What If You Were The Last Conservationist On Earth?
The Appalachianist.

22 Comments:

Blogger pipsqeak said...

You know, App, I never really thought about it before. But since most native groups had dogs, it would make sense that they hunted with them. That would be an interesting research project, changes in hunting dog use over time: pre-European contact to present. I wonder how different current training methods (absent technology and such) are from those used by early settlers and natives.

And yeah, coming from someone who doesn't hunt and doesn't live in that area (which means my opinions are obviously incredibly important ;) ) I don't see any reason why hunting deer with dogs would be a problem unless people try to cheat and take a bear or something. Do they have game wardens hanging out in hunting areas keeping an eye on things?

And I agree with you about invasive species, the zebra mussel is a big problem up where I'm from along the Ohio River from commercial shipping. Hopefully, the right decisions will be made - conserving native NC means conserving native NC wildlife. Stocking streams with random fish to make the sport fishermen happy defeats the purpose. And even though people enjoy boar hunting, I think their populations should be completely removed. They aren't native and aside from humans what is eating them to keep the numbers down?

On a side note - I'm not a fan of Tom Cruise, but Valkyrie was pretty awesome if you are looking for a good movie.

7:57 PM  
Blogger Hill Billy Rave said...

Pipsqeak, if Deer are highly abundant, it's not as much of an issue to Dog them, but in this part of the state, there's no place for it. It can be a highly effectiv means of Hunting Deer. If done too much, it can devastate a herd. Deer lay down a heavy scent and it's easy for a Dog to follow. That's the biggest "trash" Dogs will get on.

Game Wardens can be scarce, it's more of an honor system.

What I know about the Indians Dogs is mainly what I read from Charles Hudson's "The Southeastern Indians". Not much was recorded about their use from Europeans. But it's known they did use them, in addition too, there were Wolfs in the Forest and on the Praries. I imagine that the use of Dogs varied from place to place.

Hog Predators is a good question. Coyotes may take piglets. Mountain Lions are so scarce that they are of debate. They hunt solitary. Harder to do.

8:04 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Well, they certainly covered about everything in that meeting. Although I didn't see any discussion on hunting snipe.

And that video was all right although here in eastern Kentucky we go for videos like this one featuring our neighbors just over the Big Sandy river in West (by God) Virginia.

Actually, we do travel through Boone Co. WV occasionally to visit a relative in the next county over and that video isn't that far from, the truth regarding some of the folks you can run into over there (and here, even!) :-)

9:18 AM  
Blogger Hill Billy Rave said...

Darn, Guner. poor feller getting what little is left of his brain picked at. If you want to get to Heaven you've got to raise a little Hell. He's obviously the man for it. Wonder if he Buck Dances?

10:18 AM  
Blogger jcore said...

Tests were conducted on both the Interceptor body armor jacket made from David H. Brooks
and DHB industries Inc and the newer “Dragon Skin” body armor jacket model made by Pinnacle Armor Inc. The chief executive officer of Pinnacle was present during the ballistic tests and supervised the tests to ensure the proper testing. Both vests went through vigorous tests to make sure that these jackets would protect our soldiers in the line of fire. First the jackets were X-rayed and analyzed and then had to undergo a series of live fire tests which included room temperature tests, harsh environment tests, and durability and drop tests. Out of the eight Pinnacle vests that were tested, four of them failed the ballistic tests. Thirteen rounds penetrated through the vests within the first or second shot obviously failing the tests. The tests were continued to ensure that both vests were properly tested. Both vests were also subjected to various temperatures, from minus 25º F to 120º F. These tests caused the adhesive holding on the Dragon Skin’s protective discs to fail causing them to gather at the bottom of the vest, leaving unprotected gaps in the jackets.
On May 17, 2007, a news reporter for NBC challenged the Army’s use of the Interceptor body armor jacket made from David H. Brooks and DHB Industries vs. the newer “Dragon Skin” body armor jackets that were developed by Pinnacle Armor Inc. NBC accused the Pentagon of sending substandard bullet proof vests to the soldiers when they could have sent them better body armor. NBC was suggesting that the United States of America is sending our soldiers into harm’s way and putting our soldier’s lives at risk.
NBC was claiming that there was a conspiracy against the Dragon Skin body armor from Pinnacle Armor and that the Dragon Skin was more superior then the Interceptor. They believed that the government was more interested in funding than the safety of our soldiers. They have also claimed that the United States Army manipulated tests on the Dragon Skin body armor jackets to cover up the vest’s true capabilities and to ensure success with the Interceptor product line.
The government responded very quickly to the false investigative report stating that our soldiers were not being properly protected in battle and that the military is more interested in money than they are in the safety of our soldiers. Because of the serious nature of these claims made by NBC and Pinnacle Armor Inc, a congressional hearing was scheduled to verify the facts and bring light to the truth of this matter. At the hearing, Pinnacle Armor Inc was unable to offer any evidence to back up the allegations made by NBC and Pinnacle Armor Inc.
The United States of America will continue to defend the Interceptor body armor jacket made by David H. Brooks
and put the lives of our brave soldiers before the thought of profit. Our soldiers and the families of our soldiers need to be confident in the United States. Our soldiers are equipped with the best protection in the world.

12:26 PM  
Blogger Murf said...

The only thing that I understood in that whole entry was that you don't dig tattooed women. That surprises me. Not even a tramp stamp?!?

12:52 PM  
Blogger pipsqeak said...

*Hand over eyes* oh my state...it's amazing that we live in this amazingly developed and prosperous country and there are still people living in such squalid conditions. I love how the beer bottle hitting the Boone County sign was their transition frame and we got to see it over and over again. When it comes to WV documentaries the rule is usually the trashier the better. *grumbles*

App, I may have misunderstood you then, so you are agin' the deer hunting dogs? Because the herds aren't prosperous enough, right? Do they allow people to hunt down towards the cities, like G-boro and Raleigh where there are deer problems?

And was jcore's post spam or an on-going conversation that I missed somewhere?

4:07 PM  
Blogger pipsqeak said...

Murf,

I say tattoos are cool as long as they mean something. App's just being a skin elitist ; )

4:09 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I went to Westminster and then down the road to Clayton, Georgia, and over to the Dillard House and spent too much money, and came back home to find too many people got snowed in this past weekend and started to write . . . Whoeeeeeeee! Long winded writin' I got to go back and read again . . . I bought FoxFire #4 and am going to find the pages you mentioned in your blog and then I'm going to comment . . . the book seems real interesting what I have read of it. The one thing I notice that I absolutely agree with you is the zebra mussel . . . they are absolutely no good . . . I too am . . . er, a skin elitest . . . don't want no tatoo, but some of 'em are purty if they are discreet and mark direction like north . . . er, south and such or are them little butterflies and bluebirds with the . . . er, well, its a secret . . . but its better than getting your nose pierced big enough to put a big bone through it like the natives of New Guinea. Anyway, it is supposed to snow even here in Columbia so you know everyone will be reading and writing to beat the band. Oh, one thing about deer hunting . . . deer can become pest, and it changes people's attitudes about hunting, and I have noticed that the hunters seem to be the true conservationist . . . enough said. Bill

5:06 PM  
Blogger Hill Billy Rave said...

Murf, what's to like about them? It's like like someone painting graffiti on Looking Glass Rock up here. I ain't seen a tattoo that made a woman look any better than what God gave her.
You and Pipsqeak can call me a skin elitist, but it ain't like she just has a smiley face in the small of her back, it's like curtains hanging from her arms.

Pipsqeak, I think you did misunderstand me. I was being polite aboui it. Dogging Deer is allowed Down East towards the Coast. It's common and I hear it's a blast. But, there is no herd to support it here.
Say what you want about WV, it wasn't that long ago that people on the road I live on didn't have indoor plumbing. and, I live in the more (if not too) developed parts of Appalachia. They just felt like they were getting by fine without it.

I'm about to addres "Jcore".

Jcore, the Interceptor Body Armor I wore in Iraq fortunately was not put to the test. I had to lug one set in country in addition to the one I wore. Yes, the damn things worked, even though I feel like the US Infantryman is too bulky now.
And, even being effective stuff, it's bad the Congressional/Military/Industrial Complex has turned to spamming.

Bill, look for Harley Thomas. I was not snowed in, I had no more than a 1/2" Sunday morning and it left quickly. It was darn cold though. i know you figured that one out. I've got about a 1/4 " that fell here a while ago. If it's going to snow, I wish it would just snow and quit this dusting here and there stuff.

8:23 PM  
Blogger pipsqeak said...

That's why I like you, App...you're polite : )

I'm not saying anything mean about my home state. And I guess it is more than the poverty I am reacting to. It's not about not having indoor plumbing or a brick house.

The video they have of the local community is just sad...and trashy, literally. Communities with trash strown around the yards and old appliances and such dumped off in ravines. People who don't know watch that and think the whole state must be like that. And that is often the only perpective you see about it.

The tap dancer's story is actually really interesting, but the background shots of the local community just break my heart. It doesn't show a healthy, vibrant place...like most documentaries it just portrays it as aging, decaying, a place that is other. Go walk down a street in Parkersburg (although not 7th street) or Vienna and you will see a different story.

They never show the pride that people living there have, pride in who they are and what they have. I think that is what bothers me most, from that video you would think the people living there have little pride in themselves.

8:59 PM  
Blogger Hill Billy Rave said...

Oh, understand about stereo types. I recently dated a girl from WV and she isn't like that. No, people ought not play the stereo types. But, 32 squirrels is a good year.
So...What goes on on 7th Street? Got us curious now.

9:54 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Hope you didn't think I'm knocking WV, pipsqueak. You can find that same environment up a lot of the hollows here in eastern Kentucky.

Plus even though they was both born in KY my parents met in Mingo Co. WV where their parents went looking for work back about 1915 or so. They found it in the mines around Kermit and Williamson. My mom always considered herself more of a West Virginian than Kentuckian as that's where she grew up.

10:53 PM  
Blogger pipsqeak said...

AGT, no I didn't think you were knockin WV at all, I'm sorry I just got frustrated with some of the video. And probably ranted too much, I should have eaten something earlier, haha, I was a bit cranky.

The guy in the video was pretty interesting, there are definitely some characters in WV...my cousin and I snuck out to a concert at a coffeeshop in downtown Parkersburg when we were younger and the lead singer stopped to thank his people and then to talk about the two clans of werewovles who ran the city. Crazy.

App, 7th street is where all the fun things happen...or illegal, depending on how you want to look at it. It's the roughest part of Parkersburg - drugs, prostitution...plus it has its share of bars and strip clubs. Nice girls don't go walking down there alone at night, haha.

12:11 PM  
Blogger Hill Billy Rave said...

Agh, Pipsqeak, I figure we know now. Nice girls don't go down there unless they have tattoos and a Pit Bull. But if you're in with the Werewolves no one ought to mess with you.

7:06 PM  
Blogger Chuck Connors said...

You may already know this but Jim Gasque's "Hunting and Fishing in the Great Smokies" is being re-issued with a forward by Jim Casada. They didn't have it over at Oconoluftee visitors center Sunday. Guess I'll have to order it from City Lights.

11:55 PM  
Blogger Hill Billy Rave said...

WNCWU, to be honest, I'm not very familiar with that book. But, I can be now. Thanks.

7:48 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I live in Cherokee County-as far west as you can go in NC-and the wild hogs are a real problem here. Totally tearing up the woods-and people's gardens. One of my friends lives near the main four-lane highway going through the county and about a month ago the hogs destroyed her neighbors yard-and part of hers.

12:16 PM  
Blogger Hill Billy Rave said...

Howdy, Tipper. Nice blog you have. If your as far as you can go in NC, you must be around Ranger. I only pass through here once in a while.

In Cherokee County, they are still regulated by the Game Commission. The season is set and a Hunter is allowed two. As I read it, the changes would allow hog Hunting from mid September to the end of February for the five furthest Counties over. The bag limit would still be two. It's odd they didn't at least propose to increase the bag limit. As for us here in Transylvania, we can hunt them and kill as many as we can as long as something else is in season. We don't have as many as you do though.

6:45 PM  
Blogger exMI said...

Down here in Georgia you can hunt hogs whenever you want to so long as you have the property owners permission. Seems a pretty good system to me.

3:35 PM  
Blogger Hill Billy Rave said...

ExMI, we can hunt them as long as something else is in season, but unlike Ga, without Dogs. We can only hunt them with Dogs if Bear are n season.

3:04 PM  
Blogger Unknown said...

If you are really interested in hunting a feral species, then you should come down here to South Georgia and hunt for wild hogs with http://hogpredators.com I had a really great time hunting with them and filled the freezer with hog meat. Tastted great on the barbeque.

9:08 PM  

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